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Specific CCW Need!

This is a discussion on Specific CCW Need! within the Concealed Carry forums, part of the Gun Forum category; We decided on the Ruger LC9 with the laser site. Although it doesn't have ambidextrous features it will be my wife's carry so I will ...


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Old 12-30-2012, 05:40 PM   #21
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We decided on the Ruger LC9 with the laser site. Although it doesn't have ambidextrous features it will be my wife's carry so I will only be shooting it at the range anyways. It has an external safety which is a feature we were looking for and the indicator on the top when a round is chambered is another nice feature even thought it is kind of ugly. I found one at a small gun shop for $399 new which was $50-$100 cheaper than the other two stores in town. I have heard nothing but good things about it and the only complaints were personal preferences and not quality or function issues. We haven't picked it up yet but we are looking forward to getting her home cleaning her out and taking her to the range. Don't love that it only came with one magazine and a soft pouch for it instead of a hard case but that can be remedied for a small price. Thanks again for the feedback.
PS we looked at the Bersa Thunder and the Glock 27 as they didn't have the 26 and they both were a bit bigger then my wife wanted. She has gotten use to the small size of the P938.
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Old 01-02-2013, 11:03 AM   #22
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I think the point you are missing is, and your instructor is correct, is to focus on PRACTICE. Your weapon needs to be comfortable in your hand, comfortable to carry, and comfortable to operate based on hand size, carry location and hand strength. THE KEY to any gun is practice. NO gun make, model or action type negates the need for practice, practice, practice, to become proficient in its use and safe carry. You should not start to carry until you practice so much with what you are going to carry, that its use becomes second nature. Then you continue to practice every month. Get some snap caps, and practice drawing, racking, firing,reloading, reholstering and handling misfire situations, so you are really comfortable with its use, then go to the range and do the same with live ammunition. NO one day course prepares you to strap on any gun and carry it every day, I get a little nervous with folks who take a one day CPL class, then start to carry right away without the hours and hours it takes to become familiar with their gun and its safe use regardless of what kind of action it uses.
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Old 01-02-2013, 11:15 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikebambam View Post
We decided on the Ruger LC9 with the laser site. Although it doesn't have ambidextrous features it will be my wife's carry so I will only be shooting it at the range anyways. It has an external safety which is a feature we were looking for and the indicator on the top when a round is chambered is another nice feature even thought it is kind of ugly. I found one at a small gun shop for $399 new which was $50-$100 cheaper than the other two stores in town. I have heard nothing but good things about it and the only complaints were personal preferences and not quality or function issues. We haven't picked it up yet but we are looking forward to getting her home cleaning her out and taking her to the range. Don't love that it only came with one magazine and a soft pouch for it instead of a hard case but that can be remedied for a small price. Thanks again for the feedback.
PS we looked at the Bersa Thunder and the Glock 27 as they didn't have the 26 and they both were a bit bigger then my wife wanted. She has gotten use to the small size of the P938.
I picked up the LC9 and they are nice weapons. They are not range guns, but aren't designed to be. Slim, lightweight, decent sights and accurate at defensive distances. After I put a couple of hundred more rounds through mine, it will be my occasional pocket carry weapon.
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Old 01-02-2013, 01:48 PM   #24
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If I can jump in. I get where your instructor is coming from, but quite humbly disagree. Yes there is 1 extra step involved in shooting your 938 (just like the 10,000's of people carrying 1911's). You must learn to swipe the safety off as you draw the weapon. something you don't have to do with a glock or xd type firearm. That being said, you and your wife can certainly learn to do this and be proficient at it. Just go practice. Many of the guns suggested here I would consider much more complicated to use than your 938. The Bersa, Ruger, and even the Beretta all have thumb safeties that will require the same amount of practice. In addition some of these have de-cockers (operated with the same lever) further complicating the use of the weapon, in my opinion. Any of these options would require you to go rent and shoot them to decide what you like and don't like, then purchase them and train with them. Why not just get busy practicing with the 938 you already bought?

I bought a 938 Extreame about a month ago to use as my primary carry weapon. Thus far I've been nothing but pleased with it.

Whatever your going to carry, you need to practice and become proficient. Right now you have no habits to unlearn, so just start fresh with the 938. You'll be fine.
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Old 01-03-2013, 10:04 PM   #25
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If I can jump in. I get where your instructor is coming from, but quite humbly disagree. Yes there is 1 extra step involved in shooting your 938 (just like the 10,000's of people carrying 1911's). You must learn to swipe the safety off as you draw the weapon. something you don't have to do with a glock or xd type firearm. That being said, you and your wife can certainly learn to do this and be proficient at it. Just go practice. Many of the guns suggested here I would consider much more complicated to use than your 938. The Bersa, Ruger, and even the Beretta all have thumb safeties that will require the same amount of practice. In addition some of these have de-cockers (operated with the same lever) further complicating the use of the weapon, in my opinion. Any of these options would require you to go rent and shoot them to decide what you like and don't like, then purchase them and train with them. Why not just get busy practicing with the 938 you already bought?

I bought a 938 Extreame about a month ago to use as my primary carry weapon. Thus far I've been nothing but pleased with it.

Whatever your going to carry, you need to practice and become proficient. Right now you have no habits to unlearn, so just start fresh with the 938. You'll be fine.
There's a lot of truth to this. I've carried a 1911, and I've carried revolvers and SIGs and Glocks. None of them are worth a damn unless you train with them; and by the same token, you can use anything effectively if you train and learn the weapon system.

Pick what you like, then shoot the hell out of it. None of them will do you any good otherwise.
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Old 01-04-2013, 07:01 AM   #26
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Wow...A Lot of Info.

I have gone through this process with my wife, three daughters and two daughters in-law, you have my heart felt sympathy. That said, some hard learned lessons and the biggest... if they want it in pink just get it. Now the smaller issues. First find a gun range that will let you rent and let her shoot what she thinks she likes AND hates get some experience to form an opinion with. The Questions: SA/DAO/SA-DA, Semi Auto/Revolver, Cal. 380 vs 9mm, Fit - what seats best in her hand or grip (control), Conceal-ability on her BODY - in a purse? What if her purse was stolen? Each one of these is a book of questions to be worked through for you and her. Finding THE gun and carry platform is a long journey because it is individual, mine's been winding along for almost fifty years of active shooting and each time I say this is it, something comes along that is cause to reexamine what I thought would never change. Talk to range hounds that shoot a lot (typically the guys w/ shooting bags, glasses, hearing protectors and mucho ammo shot very slowly and methodically), not those with 50 and gone. Visit a lot of gun stores and talk, talk, talk. Avoid salesmen and find an enthusiast. That person will offer better advice-experience and help to steer you both. A gun is a BIG deal because it is Life or Death. Take your time. I presently carry a Kimber Ultra CDP II .45 and B/U Sig P938 both "cocked & locked" very safe 1911 platform. My Boss prefers a Taurus 85 .38 revolver, a pull and shoot no fuss arrangement. Good luck and be well.
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:15 AM   #27
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Having read EVERY post in this thread, I feel myself being edumicated more and more. I had to learn all this stuff first hand. This is what I have learned SO far from a collection of research and much reading, in respect to the above question.

If I remember correctly, the damage caused by a 9mm shot is negligibly less than that of a .45. The reason is that, even though the .45 carries a higher payload, the 9mm travels at a higher velocity. The higher payload will put a person down, but the higher velocity does about the same. The higher payload and increased amount of power also increases recoil and causes a somewhat more difficult target reacquisition. Higher alibers increase payload. Payload and muzzle velocity are inversely proportional. I chose a 9mm for recoil and target reacquisition reasons.

A JHP tends to limit collateral damage as opposed to an FMJ as the JHP tends to stop within a target as opposed to fully penetrating the target. The JHP also tends to expand much more, thereby increasing the overall circumference of the permanent cavity. I chose JHP for self-defense, but FMJ for range time and target practice.

A full-sized HG has a higher muzzle velocity overall than a compact, which is higher than a sub-compact. A sub-compact is easier to conceal, for obvious reasons. A full-size generally has less recoil due to increased weight and also has a higher magazine capacity than compacts, which, in the same fashion, is lower and higher than a sub-compact, respectively. A full size also tends to be more accurate because of a longer barrel and more rifling, allowing the bullet to spin just a little longer. A compact is more accurate than a subcompact for the same reason. When carrying, a compromise must be made in the size. You cannot carry a sub-compact and expect a high magazine capacity, or carry a full size and expect to conceal it easily. Also, consider overall weight and how long you are going to carry it daily. For this reason, I would choose to sit in the middle, at compact. I own a full-size.

People tend to prefer DA/SA because they have the choice of using the DA for the first shot and SA after that, at the cost of a longer and heavier initial trigger pull, but lighter follow-ups. DAO is sometimes preferred because you need only master 1 trigger pull. SA has more steps involved in firing and is generally not preferred for self-defense. Safeties are a toss-up. Some prefer them for added security, some don't for a more point-and-shoot interface. I choose a DAO only, but would switch to DA/SA with a safety as a backup, and so my wife doesn't freak out, when I get the opportunity. I would still carry my DAO as my primary. I own a DAO.

A holster is all personal preference. Most people CC with an IWB because they are easier to draw from. Some people use shoulder holsters and some people use ankle holsters. The new trend is appendix, at least I think its new.... I go with behind the hip IWB.

My information may be wrong, and if it is, someone tell me.
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Old 01-04-2013, 10:08 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by hwarang54 View Post
Having read EVERY post in this thread, I feel myself being edumicated more and more. I had to learn all this stuff first hand. This is what I have learned SO far from a collection of research and much reading, in respect to the above question.

If I remember correctly, the damage caused by a 9mm shot is negligibly less than that of a .45. The reason is that, even though the .45 carries a higher payload, the 9mm travels at a higher velocity. The higher payload will put a person down, but the higher velocity does about the same. The higher payload and increased amount of power also increases recoil and causes a somewhat more difficult target reacquisition. Higher alibers increase payload. Payload and muzzle velocity are inversely proportional. I chose a 9mm for recoil and target reacquisition reasons.

A JHP tends to limit collateral damage as opposed to an FMJ as the JHP tends to stop within a target as opposed to fully penetrating the target. The JHP also tends to expand much more, thereby increasing the overall circumference of the permanent cavity. I chose JHP for self-defense, but FMJ for range time and target practice.

A full-sized HG has a higher muzzle velocity overall than a compact, which is higher than a sub-compact. A sub-compact is easier to conceal, for obvious reasons. A full-size generally has less recoil due to increased weight and also has a higher magazine capacity than compacts, which, in the same fashion, is lower and higher than a sub-compact, respectively. A full size also tends to be more accurate because of a longer barrel and more rifling, allowing the bullet to spin just a little longer. A compact is more accurate than a subcompact for the same reason. When carrying, a compromise must be made in the size. You cannot carry a sub-compact and expect a high magazine capacity, or carry a full size and expect to conceal it easily. Also, consider overall weight and how long you are going to carry it daily. For this reason, I would choose to sit in the middle, at compact. I own a full-size.

People tend to prefer DA/SA because they have the choice of using the DA for the first shot and SA after that, at the cost of a longer and heavier initial trigger pull, but lighter follow-ups. DAO is sometimes preferred because you need only master 1 trigger pull. SA has more steps involved in firing and is generally not preferred for self-defense. Safeties are a toss-up. Some prefer them for added security, some don't for a more point-and-shoot interface. I choose a DAO only, but would switch to DA/SA with a safety as a backup, and so my wife doesn't freak out, when I get the opportunity. I would still carry my DAO as my primary. I own a DAO.

A holster is all personal preference. Most people CC with an IWB because they are easier to draw from. Some people use shoulder holsters and some people use ankle holsters. The new trend is appendix, at least I think its new.... I go with behind the hip IWB.

My information may be wrong, and if it is, someone tell me.
Pretty good summary over all, but I would suggest a couple revisions.

SAO has LESS steps involved if you are separating out safeties for its own discussion. The only thing that adds steps to a SAO is that they will (almost) always have a safety whereas other action types may or may not have safeties. With DA/SA the first DA pull often IS the safety(Sig 226, 229, 220, etc). That's why its there. Just like a DAO that doesn't have an external safety(Sig 290, Kahr PM9). Some DA/SA guns will also have an external thumb safety (Bersa Thunder 380, Beretta PX4, FNX-9, etc...)

IWB holsters are not going to be easier to draw from, but are easier to conceal.

Last edited by T34C; 01-04-2013 at 10:11 AM.
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Old 01-04-2013, 10:17 AM   #29
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Pretty good summary over all, but I would suggest a couple revisions.

SAO has LESS steps involved if you are separating out safeties for its own discussion. The only thing that adds steps to a SAO is that they will (almost) always have a safety whereas other action types may or may not have safeties. With DA/SA the first DA pull often IS the safety(Sig 226, 229, 220, etc). That's why its there. Just like a DAO that doesn't have an external safety(Sig 290, Kahr PM9). Some DA/SA guns will also have an external thumb safety (Bersa Thunder 380, Beretta PX4, FNX-9, etc...)

IWB holsters are not going to be easier to draw from, but are easier to conceal.
Thanks for the corrections. I am not very well versed in SAO actions, so that is a big help.

I also did mean that IWB are easier to conceal. I think I was halfway into saying that OWB are easier to draw from, but combined the two. Classic "brain faster than fingers."

Last edited by hwarang54; 01-04-2013 at 10:19 AM.
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Old 01-04-2013, 10:24 AM   #30
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I have gone through this process with my wife, three daughters and two daughters in-law, you have my heart felt sympathy. That said, some hard learned lessons and the biggest... if they want it in pink just get it. Now the smaller issues. First find a gun range that will let you rent and let her shoot what she thinks she likes AND hates get some experience to form an opinion with. The Questions: SA/DAO/SA-DA, Semi Auto/Revolver, Cal. 380 vs 9mm, Fit - what seats best in her hand or grip (control), Conceal-ability on her BODY - in a purse? What if her purse was stolen? Each one of these is a book of questions to be worked through for you and her. Finding THE gun and carry platform is a long journey because it is individual, mine's been winding along for almost fifty years of active shooting and each time I say this is it, something comes along that is cause to reexamine what I thought would never change. Talk to range hounds that shoot a lot (typically the guys w/ shooting bags, glasses, hearing protectors and mucho ammo shot very slowly and methodically), not those with 50 and gone. Visit a lot of gun stores and talk, talk, talk. Avoid salesmen and find an enthusiast. That person will offer better advice-experience and help to steer you both. A gun is a BIG deal because it is Life or Death. Take your time. I presently carry a Kimber Ultra CDP II .45 and B/U Sig P938 both "cocked & locked" very safe 1911 platform. My Boss prefers a Taurus 85 .38 revolver, a pull and shoot no fuss arrangement. Good luck and be well.
it's nice to have an employer that supports carrying at work.
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Old 01-04-2013, 02:20 PM   #31
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it's nice to have an employer that supports carrying at work.
For real. Must be nice.
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Old 01-05-2013, 06:02 AM   #32
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The "Boss"...

A little disclosure about the "Boss", she's about 5'2" , 108# and we've been spending a lot of time together for the past 33yrs.
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:52 AM   #33
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so you're a slave?
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Old 01-05-2013, 05:31 PM   #34
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Ironically, I haven't seen anyone mention the P290. DAO and a fairly compact 9mm. Many are coming with lasers as well. The P238 and P938 are nice also. As always, train with what you carry.
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Old 01-11-2013, 06:15 AM   #35
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I know practice is key so have no fear we are taking our practice very seriously. We do have snap caps and I am waiting on a IWB holster to start working on my drawing techniques. We love the 938 but my wife wanted a gun and a second P938 was out of our price range. Considering we have an appointment in March to apply for our concealed weapons licenses we have plenty of time to practice before we can even legally carry. We decided to go to the regional office for our county and apply electronically so that it doesn't take a year to process like i hear it would if we did it by paper.

On a side note my wife said she thinks she wants to carry on her person after all these comments and the instructor saying the purse is a bad idea so that is good news. Now the fun of figuring out how she wants to carry it and finding a good holster at a reasonable price.
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Old 01-25-2013, 01:01 PM   #36
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My wife is recoil sensitive so nothing too big works. We both have dropped to smaller guns: I like to CC a S&W Shield and also have the Taurus 709. Both great guns, Shield better trigger and sights. BUT the Taurus has had 100's of rds down it, very accurate (had to play with the sights a bit), recoil for a small 9 is nothing (Son has KelTec PF9 and it is bad). Same for the Shield very light recoil and both very thin. For the price 709 is good buy. LCP 9 is great gun too. These are not range guns, but you can go out and shoot without any "pain". Bersa's are cool too. These can also have thumb safeties if that's something you want. Just practice taking it off and on. A 9 mm with modern SD ammo at short ranges (3-10 yds) is more than capable.

Last edited by gertieguy; 01-25-2013 at 01:05 PM.
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Old 01-25-2013, 04:36 PM   #37
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For my wife we went with the Taurus 85UL. Weighs in at 15oz empty, shoots 38 special+P. She tried 380s, 9s and even a 357. She decided on the 38 because of the ease of a wheel gun. No thing before firing, pull trigger go boom, no boom?? Pull again. The 38 does not kick her butt when firing. Me, I personally like the DA/SA or DAO for carry. I love the 1911 system, but does require allot more training and practice to become proficient with. My suggestion is try as many guns as you can and go with the one YOU are comfortable with. If you are scared or nervous with a gun you may not use it when needed or worse yet, use it wrong and hurt yourself or someone other then your target.
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Old 01-26-2013, 05:10 AM   #38
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I used to carry a Glock for CCW but it jammed all the time. The round always got stuck halfway in the barrel. I no longer trust Glocks. I then bought a Sig P226 in 9mm and it has yet to have a failure to feed or eject. It has been 100% reliable and is easy to conceal carry inside the waistband. Make sure you have a good gun belt (extra thick compared to normal belts) and I wear a t-shirt one size too big and pants that are too big for me (doesn't stay up without the belt). I have always been a baggy clothes person so carrying guns concealed came easy. The Sig P226 was expensive but after seeing the accuracy compared to Glocks and the complete reliablitiy the switch was easy. Glock fans attack me all you want, I used to have 3 glocks so it is not like I didn't give them a chance.
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Old 01-30-2013, 04:51 PM   #39
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o.k., I'll throw out my 1.3 cents (which is whats left of my 2 cents after taxes).

I have carried glock's, 1911's, and revolvers. in fact, as we speak, my BUG is a j-frame DAO .38 and I edc a p220 elite. I will not get in to X vs. Y or what lead me to ditch one for the other, What I will say is in my experience, if you don't trust your gun.....you'll leave it at home or even worse in a critical situation you'll hesitate and THAT can be fatal.

Train, Train, Train, have lunch and Train some more. "your gun is the only life insurance policy that you live to see pay off"



p.s. Enjoy the LC9. I hear good things about them.

Last edited by 220Elite; 01-30-2013 at 04:58 PM.
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Old 01-30-2013, 05:27 PM   #40
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2 hours a week for 6 months? seems a little much.

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