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Intimidation factor

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Old 01-04-2013, 12:46 PM   #31
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well said
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:10 PM   #32
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I didn't post the link to be all "This is what you can get away with." The fact that it happened is outrageous.
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Old 01-04-2013, 08:38 PM   #33
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In today's day of frivilous lawsuits, I think if I clear leather it's going to go "bang" - and it will definitely be the last resort. To get to that point, every possible avenue will be utilized - even if it means flight...
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Old 01-05-2013, 01:16 AM   #34
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My first training came from range master who was also a tactical entry leader. He came in first in the only gunfight he was in. There was no second-place winner.

His thoughts on the matter that we are not shooting to kill; we are shooting to stop the action that caused us to shoot in the first place.

A kill, or a wound, is in an after-the-fact consequence, he explained. Shoot at the center mass of what you can see.
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:42 AM   #35
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To me if you have to imtimidate you put yourself in a bad situation. When in public you should be alert, stay alert, know what your surrounding are, and who is around you. You should never brandish, that's showing off. If the situation has turned into a shituation, then you should deploy the weapon, and use that force that is needed to stop the threat. Most of the time deploying your weapon and directing at the threat is enough to stop it. If you are faced with a threat give loud, clear commands to the threat...don't threaten. If it's in a public place and you deploy your weapon people are going to be calling and the law enforcement are going to come running. If you are with someone have them call 911 so they can advise them what the situation is, let them know how to identify you, who you are, and that you aren't the threat. keep your attention on the threat, stay in control of yourself, and keep giving commands. Those other people around you may not know what is going on, but they will be on the phone yelling at the dispatcher that someone has a gun. When law enforcement gets there they won't know who you are, and will see you as a threat. ID yourself as soon as possible, and listen to their commands, because they aren't going to argue with you about gun rights.
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:57 AM   #36
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good points
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:57 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SiGDaK View Post
To me if you have to imtimidate you put yourself in a bad situation. When in public you should be alert, stay alert, know what your surrounding are, and who is around you. You should never brandish, that's showing off. If the situation has turned into a shituation, then you should deploy the weapon, and use that force that is needed to stop the threat. Most of the time deploying your weapon and directing at the threat is enough to stop it. If you are faced with a threat give loud, clear commands to the threat...don't threaten. If it's in a public place and you deploy your weapon people are going to be calling and the law enforcement are going to come running. If you are with someone have them call 911 so they can advise them what the situation is, let them know how to identify you, who you are, and that you aren't the threat. keep your attention on the threat, stay in control of yourself, and keep giving commands. Those other people around you may not know what is going on, but they will be on the phone yelling at the dispatcher that someone has a gun. When law enforcement gets there they won't know who you are, and will see you as a threat. ID yourself as soon as possible, and listen to their commands, because they aren't going to argue with you about gun rights.

These are, indeed, good points. +1
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Old 01-09-2013, 02:45 PM   #38
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Intimidation is actually the complete opposite of what you want to do when you're carrying a weapon. In my opinion, in the ideal defensive situation, the bad guy will never even know you're armed until is far too late, if at all. If I can keep myself concealed and maneuver into a position to take out a threat without them ever even knowing I'm there, great. I'm not worried about fighting fairly. I've also personally decided that if I ever have to unholster my weapon, there's about a 99.9% chance I'm going to be using it for its intended purpose, because I'm not going to pull my weapon unless I'm pretty darn sure I have no other option but to use it to defend myself or others. And, once you start sending rounds down range, intimidation is not a factor because all you're trying to do is stop the threat, not intimidate.

Also, in most jurisdictions, if anyone knows you have a gun you could be subject to "brandishing" or at the very least "failure to properly conceal" charges even if you were right to pull your weapon or it just accidently became visible. So, making sure no one knows you're armed is pretty important. Instead, when in public you should remain alert and aware of your surroundings, walk with confidence, and keep your head on a swivel. When you do that, the bad guys will look at you and think you're not the person to mess with. The term we learn in the military for that is to make yourself a hard target. If you look alert and prepared for danger, most bad guys will seek a more vulnerable target.
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Old 01-09-2013, 03:55 PM   #39
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Ok.... I have had time to think more clearly on this and, with much research and learning, would like to restate my question in a much clearer sense.

First I would like to apologize to everyone that thinks I'm a wacko nut-job who wants to carry around a Dirty Harry gun to show it to everyone I think looks weird. This was not my intention.

What I meant to say was closer to something like this: What would the likelihood be of a BG turning and running when you draw a firearm, in lawful self-defense? I have seen some "carry" pistols, namely Derringer (sorry if you own one) that if I TRUELY want to do someone ill-will, I would sit there and laugh at them, as opposed to a P226 or 1911, which I would quickly turn and run as fast as I could. Also, in the same scenario, I would be more likely to run from someone who looks like they trained, as opposed to someone gripping the pistol one-handed and parallel to the floor.

To try and be more on target here: What is the likelihood that I would have to actually fire my pistol after the BG has seen it? Does the fact that I am armed have any psychological effect on the BG's reaction? I guess, what I am trying to do is put you in the BG's shoes for now, although we all know that we are not them, nor will we ever be, hopefully. If I ever have to draw, I would have EVERY intention of making that 4-mile DAO P250 trigger pull.

Perhaps the LEO/MIL have more insight on this than I do. First, I would like to SINCERELY thank all of you LEO/MIL for your service or continued service, but I hope to never see what you have to, nor do the things that you do on a daily basis. I am simply an individual exercising my rights to protect myself and my loved ones. I do wish, however, that I could get the kind of training you do....

Thank you all for your responses and not treating me like I'm a complete idiot, just new to the whole HG and CC thing.
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Old 01-09-2013, 04:10 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hwarang54 View Post
Ok.... I have had time to think more clearly on this and, with much research and learning, would like to restate my question in a much clearer sense.

First I would like to apologize to everyone that thinks I'm a wacko nut-job who wants to carry around a Dirty Harry gun to show it to everyone I think looks weird. This was not my intention.

What I meant to say was closer to something like this: What would the likelihood be of a BG turning and running when you draw a firearm, in lawful self-defense? I have seen some "carry" pistols, namely Derringer (sorry if you own one) that if I TRUELY want to do someone ill-will, I would sit there and laugh at them, as opposed to a P226 or 1911, which I would quickly turn and run as fast as I could. Also, in the same scenario, I would be more likely to run from someone who looks like they trained, as opposed to someone gripping the pistol one-handed and parallel to the floor.

To try and be more on target here: What is the likelihood that I would have to actually fire my pistol after the BG has seen it? Does the fact that I am armed have any psychological effect on the BG's reaction? I guess, what I am trying to do is put you in the BG's shoes for now, although we all know that we are not them, nor will we ever be, hopefully. If I ever have to draw, I would have EVERY intention of making that 4-mile DAO P250 trigger pull.

Perhaps the LEO/MIL have more insight on this than I do. First, I would like to SINCERELY thank all of you LEO/MIL for your service or continued service, but I hope to never see what you have to, nor do the things that you do on a daily basis. I am simply an individual exercising my rights to protect myself and my loved ones. I do wish, however, that I could get the kind of training you do....

Thank you all for your responses and not treating me like I'm a complete idiot, just new to the whole HG and CC thing.
Well, in Virginia I can't draw on someone unless I am in mortal fear for my life or the life of someone else. If I am already struggling with someone who is trying to kill me and I can reach my weapon, I am going to shoot him, simple as that. In that instance it's me or him, and I'd prefer to come out ahead.

The other scenario in which I might draw is if someone comes at me with a deadly weapon but hasn't closed the distance yet. If that weapon is anything short of a gun, such as a knife or a bat, I would cover them and command them to "stop because I don't want to shoot you." I would say that very, very loud hoping that some third party witness might hear me declare my reluctance to shoot. If they continued to rush me with a deadly weapon despite the warning, I would fire.

This second scenario, of course, assumes that I would have time to do all that prior to firing, which might not be the case. It is amazing how much distance you need between you and a threat armed with a knife in order to be able to draw and fire before they can reach you.
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Old 01-09-2013, 04:20 PM   #41
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This is more of an "If" question. We obviously want to be prepared for any and all situations, but "If" you drew in time for the attacker to see it.
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Old 01-09-2013, 04:27 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by hwarang54 View Post
This is more of an "If" question. We obviously want to be prepared for any and all situations, but "If" you drew in time for the attacker to see it.
Sorry--I forgot to specifically answer that. Yes, I think that most rational people (even BGs) would halt and retreat once they realize that they brought a knife to what is going to be a gunfight unless they check themselves. Logic doesn't apply to drug addicts or psychotics though.
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Old 01-09-2013, 04:31 PM   #43
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Sorry--I forgot to specifically answer that. Yes, I think that most rational people (even BGs) would halt and retreat once they realize that they brought a knife to what is going to be a gunfight unless they check themselves.
I know the question brings up a lot of various experiences, varying laws, varying circumstances, and would probably, if answered in it's entirety, be able to be written in a textbook. I appreciate your answer though. I have found this thread to be very thought provoking.......
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:26 PM   #44
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If the B g is armed and I feel my life or others lives are at risk I draw to shoot to kill ( I never was good at show and tell in school ). If you decide to carry then you should practice, practice , practice and I don't just mean shooting at paper you should practice your draw. alot of people fail to practice that and alot of times their own weapon is used against them. Only you will know if and when you are ready to carry !!
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Old 01-09-2013, 05:46 PM   #45
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If the B g is armed and I feel my life or others lives are at risk I draw to shoot to kill ( I never was good at show and tell in school ). If you decide to carry then you should practice, practice , practice and I don't just mean shooting at paper you should practice your draw. alot of people fail to practice that and alot of times their own weapon is used against them. Only you will know if and when you are ready to carry !!
I agree with u

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