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Targeting for the vision impaired.

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Old 06-12-2016, 03:23 PM   #1
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Targeting for the vision impaired.

Shooting tight groups is not easy in the golden years. I wear contacts for distance (+4.75) and then readers (+1.75) on top of that for close up. When shooting I'm having a hard time deciding which is the lesser of evils. Wear the readers and I can see the front sight, or without and I can see the target.

I'm thinking it's better to practice without the readers because in a real life or death situation I probably won't have the readers on.

Getting old sucks.
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Old 06-13-2016, 01:51 AM   #2
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Getting old sucks.
Beats the alternative
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Old 06-13-2016, 02:36 AM   #3
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You should practice both. For self defense practice, bring the target close - 9 ft and shoot without the readers. If your range allows it, practice draw from holster and shoot, 3 shots rapid fire (2 shots center mass, 1 shot head). If not allowed, practice starting from low ready, bring up to position and shoot as fast as allowed.

For target practice, put on the readers and send the target out to 21 feet. Select a target that works best with your front sight (if your front sight is black, don't use a black target, experiment with different colors). Put that clear front sight picture in the middle of the blurry target picture, and shoot slowly, practicing good technique, breathing, and form. If you enjoy the target practice, you might look into different sights (target sights) as well.

Good luck!
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Old 06-13-2016, 04:34 AM   #4
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I'll go down to the range today and experiment some. Normally I use the readers for a clear front sight and shoot 7 to 25 yards. At 7 yards it's not to bad but out st 25 it's nearly impossible to see any more than just the papers outline. The sight covers the entire silouett.

I've never tried shooting at distanced as close as 9 feet. At such close distanced do you actually use the sites or just point and shoot?
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Old 06-13-2016, 04:36 AM   #5
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All the members of my weekly shooting group have the same condition as you (presbyopia) and we've talked about this pretty extensively. The general consensus was to not look through readers, just look through the distance lenses, focus as intensively as you can on the front sight and shoot that way. It's very fast after you get used to it.

A lot of us shoot pretty impressive groups, so it works but it does take practice.
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Old 06-13-2016, 05:07 AM   #6
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I'll go down to the range today and experiment some. Normally I use the readers for a clear front sight and shoot 7 to 25 yards. At 7 yards it's not to bad but out st 25 it's nearly impossible to see any more than just the papers outline. The sight covers the entire silouett.

I've never tried shooting at distanced as close as 9 feet. At such close distanced do you actually use the sites or just point and shoot?
Point and shoot for the first 2 shots centermass, half second pause to line up the sights for the headshot.

I rarely shoot pistols out to 75 feet, the most that I do is 50 feet (unless I have a scope). If you want to shoot out to 25 yards or more, the adjustable target sights make a lot of sense - you can adjust the sights to use the sight picture #1 instead of #3, and you set the blurry target circle right onto the top of the sights. Without adjustable sights, I would try to align the sights right at the top of the blurry target and see if you can get a consistent grouping slightly higher than center.

When I say head shot, I actually mean right at the base of the neck. You shoot too high, you get a head shot. You shoot too low, you get heart and lung. You shoot left and right, you might still clip a shoulder. A neck shot, the attacker will bleed out in seconds. In my training classes, the neck shot is the new "head shot". And in fact, the instructors mentioned that in the law enforcement and military, they are encouraging people NOT to wear white tshirts under the uniform because the white triangle that shows up at the neck will present an easy target.
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Old 06-13-2016, 05:47 AM   #7
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When I say head shot, I actually mean right at the base of the neck. You shoot too high, you get a head shot. You shoot too low, you get heart and lung. You shoot left and right, you might still clip a shoulder. A neck shot, the attacker will bleed out in seconds. In my training classes, the neck shot is the new "head shot". And in fact, the instructors mentioned that in the law enforcement and military, they are encouraging people NOT to wear white tshirts under the uniform because the white triangle that shows up at the neck will present an easy target.
Darn, the secret is out.
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Old 06-13-2016, 06:58 AM   #8
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Great advise. Thank you.
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Old 06-30-2016, 05:22 PM   #9
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I'm a younger guy with old eyes, looking more and more at RDS options as things improve.
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Old 07-01-2016, 03:38 PM   #10
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My thoughts are with you as to the poor eyes.
However we should understand our limitations and work within those parameters.

Shooting at targets is one thing, but shooting to save your life encompasses a whole different set of rules. One rule that covers both is target identification.
Another is: " Can I legally and morally shoot this person ? )
Can I accurately and factually articulate what I saw and why I fired my weapon ?
I can't say I would ever recommend shooting at a fuzzy outline
If your outside of your visual limitations and the fuzzy outline is an innocent person with a cell phone in his or her hand, it could be a disaster for all involved.

Eyes are the windows to the soul.
and hands are the windows to intentions. If you can see the hands.

25 yards is actually a long self defense shot, many things come into play with a shot that long.
Could I have avoided the incident ?
Were there no options for retreat ?
The questions could go on and on.

No matter what the distance, and I think I could safely say that most self defense shootings happen within the length of a normal car, down to actual contact.
With about 6 to 7 shots fired.

In reality I would forget the head shots, why ?
Someone shot 2 times in center mass will not be posing for a head shot.
So the smaller target becomes an increasingly harder target when it's bobbing around.

Don't get me wrong, sometimes a head shot is definitely needed to stop a threat,
Keeping in mind also that we do not shoot to kill but to stop a threat.

Using only the front sight as apposed to a front site rear sight in depended on the size of the target, the time involved, and how good the shooter is.

Also lets remember that in a stressful situation your probably going to shoot to about 50% of your ability,
and a Bad guy is not always a stand alone target, many times innocent people are close by and a miss could result in a disastrous outcome.

Hope I have not offended anyone -- it's just my take on it.
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Last edited by gray wolf; 07-01-2016 at 03:46 PM.
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Old 07-01-2016, 06:48 PM   #11
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When You go for the Texas CHL now LTC You have to shoot at 3,7 and 15 yards
You shoot 20 rounds at both 3 and 7 yards and 10 at 15 yards. There are different
Sequences This is the 3 yard one
5 rounds 2 seconds apart 1 at a time 10 rounds 3 seconds apart 2 at a time then
5 rounds in 10 seconds
The 15 yard is the hardest 5 Rounds 2 in 6 seconds 3 rounds in 9 seconds
lastly 5 rounds in 15 seconds
You have to score 175 out of a possible 250. The 8,9 and X are 5 points the 7 is 4 points
and the outer part is 3. The Head is also 3/ The 7 yard one has 4 sequences

I took it last Saturday and got 238 using My 22 year old Glock 22 that I had only shot once
before, that being last Wednesday
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Old 08-03-2016, 11:19 AM   #12
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I would think, under most circumstances, unless you can't move or are protecting someone who can't move.......25 yards is enough distance to remove yourself from a gunfight.......unless someone else already started it. Nearly all statistics I recall lead me think 25 yards is an exceptionally long distance for a defensive handgun encounter.
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Old 08-12-2016, 02:27 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duckman View Post
Shooting tight groups is not easy in the golden years. I wear contacts for distance (+4.75) and then readers (+1.75) on top of that for close up. When shooting I'm having a hard time deciding which is the lesser of evils. Wear the readers and I can see the front sight, or without and I can see the target.

I'm thinking it's better to practice without the readers because in a real life or death situation I probably won't have the readers on.

Getting old sucks.
I have the exact same issue, contacts for distance and 1.50 readers. After much trial and error I chose to shoot without cheaters as I am able to see everything out in front of me better. In a shooting situation I want to be able to clearly see what is around and near my target, can't do that with cheaters on. That being said, my groups are not what they used to be.
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Old 08-12-2016, 03:26 AM   #14
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A lot of good points here. Wife is legally blind (albino) which led me to put lasers on 3 pistols. We rarely turn them on at the range. But practice point and shoot on torso targets at 7 yards. She does very well. I strongly suggest taking some classes in basic handgun and self defense and use .45 auto
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Old 08-12-2016, 07:58 AM   #15
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The last couple of trips to the range I've practiced doing quick point and shoot. No readers, both eyes open and focused on the target. For each shot start with the gun held at the waist with both hands on it. Then quickly bring the gun up and shoot. This was 50 rounds at 21 feet. I was pleased enough to take a picture of it.




And for comparison this is 50 rounds at the same 21 feet using the +1.5 readers focusing on the front sight and taking my time.

I think I've convinced myself that at close range in a home defense scenario, I don't need the readers.

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Last edited by Duckman; 08-12-2016 at 08:21 AM.
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