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P238 take-down lever

This is a discussion on P238 take-down lever within the P238, P938 Pistol forums, part of the SIG Sauer Pistols category; Update - I received the replacement Slide Stop spring from Sig today and installed it. When I first installed it, *making sure that the tang ...


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P238, P938 Pistol All variations P238, P938

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Old 01-04-2017, 04:00 PM   #46
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Update - I received the replacement Slide Stop spring from Sig today and installed it.

When I first installed it, *making sure that the tang with the barbed end was fully seated in the pin hole*, it was bulging slightly, similar to the way my original spring was from the factory.....
When I racked the slide without a mag in, the slide locked open (which it should not do).

I took it out, made a very slight "tweak" bending the looped part so that it would lay flatter in the cavity, and reinstalled it. (See photo)



Now the spring fits flat and tight in the cavity.
Racked the slide many times without a mag in - Slide did not lock open, and the Slide Stop did not walk out.
Racked the slide with empty mag in - Slide locked open, as it should.

Took the P238 to the range and fired 100 rounds of same ammo which i used on previous range trips. No issues!
Slide Stop did not walk out, and locked open after last shot!

So, my theory and conclusion is that the Slide Stop springs need to be fitted (tweaked) by the technicians at the factory, and some do it better than others......Based on the fact that on my wife's P238 the spring was flat and fully seated in it's cavity, and has not had any problems. Whereas, mine was slightly bulging from the factory, and did have walking out issues. Also, the fact that the replacement spring that I received did not sit flat until I "hand fitted" it.

Thanks to all for your thoughts and input to help me resolve this issue.
I hope that any others that experience either the walking out issue, or the slide locking open without a mag in, may find this thread useful.

Last edited by GunnyBlue; 01-04-2017 at 04:06 PM. Reason: typo
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Old 01-04-2017, 04:22 PM   #47
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That spring should be "staked" into the frame. Not sure what exactly that is from "installed", but it could make a difference. It should indeed lay flat.

G.
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Old 01-07-2017, 08:24 PM   #48
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I was sitting here familiarizing myself with my new 938 when I was pulling the slide back, slowly, trying to line up the "keyhole" for lack of a better term, the lock pin fell out. I immediately went to this post after it happened and went to the video on it. When I first got the gun the pin was tight and it took some pushing to get it out. I'm convinced this isn't an issue. That spring keeps the lever down until there is a magazine I don't believe it holds the lever in place. I think the problem with the slide not staying back is either a magazine problem, as it's the tab on the magazine carrier that pushes up the stop upon an empty mag, or the lever is sticking down. It's very likely I too could have bent the spring as it was flush to the frame if I recall, but the spring is doing what it should. Bumper is right I think in as the slide is cycling so fast the pin would never walk out.

*UPDATE*. I took the gun apart this morning thinking I did something wrong. Safety check as the gun has been unloaded, as I have been familiarizing myself with it. I believe I took the slide off with the magazine in place pushing the slide lock up. This will bend the pin out and sines its captured, it won't fall out, just bend. I took the slide off and took a punch, roughly the same diameter as the little pocket and pushed the spring flat against the frame. The slide lock does not fall out. I'll never try to pull the slide off with the magazine in place. The spring probably keeps enough tension on the lock to keep it in place.

Last edited by Sterg; 01-08-2017 at 06:32 AM.
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Old 01-08-2017, 12:15 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sterg View Post
I was sitting here familiarizing myself with my new 938 when I was pulling the slide back, slowly, trying to line up the "keyhole" for lack of a better term, the lock pin fell out. I immediately went to this post after it happened and went to the video on it. When I first got the gun the pin was tight and it took some pushing to get it out. I'm convinced this isn't an issue. That spring keeps the lever down until there is a magazine I don't believe it holds the lever in place. I think the problem with the slide not staying back is either a magazine problem, as it's the tab on the magazine carrier that pushes up the stop upon an empty mag, or the lever is sticking down. It's very likely I too could have bent the spring as it was flush to the frame if I recall, but the spring is doing what it should. Bumper is right I think in as the slide is cycling so fast the pin would never walk out.

*UPDATE*. I took the gun apart this morning thinking I did something wrong. Safety check as the gun has been unloaded, as I have been familiarizing myself with it. I believe I took the slide off with the magazine in place pushing the slide lock up. This will bend the pin out and sines its captured, it won't fall out, just bend. I took the slide off and took a punch, roughly the same diameter as the little pocket and pushed the spring flat against the frame. The slide lock does not fall out. I'll never try to pull the slide off with the magazine in place. The spring probably keeps enough tension on the lock to keep it in place.
I was thinking that the FIRST thing one should do before working with a weapon is drop the mag, rack the slide, and make sure the gun is in fact clear. Following that rule will insure that you never attempt to take the gun apart or shoot yourself with an accidental round lurking in the gun.

G.
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Old 01-08-2017, 12:49 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by garyji View Post
I was thinking that the FIRST thing one should do before working with a weapon is drop the mag, rack the slide, and make sure the gun is in fact clear. Following that rule will insure that you never attempt to take the gun apart or shoot yourself with an accidental round lurking in the gun.

G.
I was, and did. However, sitting in my armchair with ammunition on the third floor in a can, I happened to be checking the thing out.
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Old 01-08-2017, 01:14 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sterg View Post
I was sitting here familiarizing myself with my new 938 when I was pulling the slide back, slowly, trying to line up the "keyhole" for lack of a better term, the lock pin fell out. I immediately went to this post after it happened and went to the video on it. When I first got the gun the pin was tight and it took some pushing to get it out. I'm convinced this isn't an issue. That spring keeps the lever down until there is a magazine I don't believe it holds the lever in place. I think the problem with the slide not staying back is either a magazine problem, as it's the tab on the magazine carrier that pushes up the stop upon an empty mag, or the lever is sticking down. It's very likely I too could have bent the spring as it was flush to the frame if I recall, but the spring is doing what it should. Bumper is right I think in as the slide is cycling so fast the pin would never walk out.

*UPDATE*. I took the gun apart this morning thinking I did something wrong. Safety check as the gun has been unloaded, as I have been familiarizing myself with it. I believe I took the slide off with the magazine in place pushing the slide lock up. This will bend the pin out and sines its captured, it won't fall out, just bend. I took the slide off and took a punch, roughly the same diameter as the little pocket and pushed the spring flat against the frame. The slide lock does not fall out. I'll never try to pull the slide off with the magazine in place. The spring probably keeps enough tension on the lock to keep it in place.
I agree - it doesn't "hold" the Slide Stop in, BUT, if the spring/pin is bent or not fully seated in its cavity such that it is exerting lateral tension on the Slide Stop, it is like pressing on the Slide Stop shaft on the right side of the gun, which causes the Slide Stop to walk out when the slide is racked.

Also, if the "tang" (long end of the spring) is bent, it will cause the slide to lock open without a mag in.
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Old 01-08-2017, 01:30 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by GunnyBlue View Post
I agree - it doesn't "hold" the Slide Stop in, BUT, if the spring/pin is bent or not fully seated in its cavity such that it is exerting lateral tension on the Slide Stop, it is like pressing on the Slide Stop shaft on the right side of the gun, which causes the Slide Stop to walk out when the slide is racked.

Also, if the "tang" (long end of the spring) is bent, it will cause the slide to lock open without a mag in.
I agree also. I'll be keeping an eye on the spring making sure it doesn't pop out. If they had a groove milled in the pocket at the bottom so the spring could nest into they probably wouldn't have the swedge it in. If it becomes a problem I'll let Sig Sauer fix it. How did you get the tab on the spring to seat in the hole? The video on YouTube, the guy was pushing the spring in and it was springing back out of the hole.
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Last edited by Sterg; 01-08-2017 at 01:35 PM.
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Old 01-13-2017, 10:42 AM   #53
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How did you get the tab on the spring to seat in the hole?
I had to manually re-shape the spring a bit.

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Old 01-18-2017, 04:16 AM   #54
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May Have Spoken To Soon

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Originally Posted by ThnkFrst View Post
If my pin/spring is sitting flush in the bottom of the pocket in the frame, my slide lock will stay in the frame with the left side down as you describe until I shake the frame.

If my pin/spring is sitting up in the pocket where it usually is after operating the slide, the slide stop will fall out as soon as I tilt the left side of the frame down.

I used to think that the slide lock pin/spring helped hold the slide lock in the frame during pistol operation, but I don't believe that any longer. As loose as my slide lock is, I've never had an issue with it falling out during operation or even moving out enough to jam the slide.
The slide lock spring in my 938 has always had a tendency to move up in the frame pocket during operation, which is to say it moves to the left of pistol centerline. I've made it a habit of pressing it down into the bottom of the frame pocket before mounting the slide. It's always done this, even after SIG replaced the slide lock spring for being loose back in the beginning. Over time it's gotten easier to move the spring up and down in the pocket.

I've run 1300 rounds thru the pistol without any malfunctions. During my last range session I fired 65 rounds and experienced 7 incidents of the slide locking back mid-mag; the slide lock had moved up enough to barely catch the slide catch notch in the slide. Depressing the slide catch lever released the slide and the pistol fired normally. Note; I verified that I wasn't hitting the slide lock when shooting.

On disassembly I found that the spring had moved up in the pocket even further than it usually does, so much so that the loop of the spring was outside the frame pocket and the tail of the spring that holds the slide lock down was angled upwards which let the slide lock move up a bit before the spring made firm contact.

Reported the problem to SIG CS and they are sending a replacement spring which I'll install and see if that resolves the problem. More to follow.
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Old 01-18-2017, 04:50 AM   #55
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My slide stop spring has a slight twist to it like the picture in GunnyBlue's post. When viewing the frame from the side, the entire spring rests inside the pocket with none of it protruding past the edge of the frame.

If I had to replace the spring, I would be inclined to adjust it as necessary and run with it.
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Old 01-18-2017, 01:07 PM   #56
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My slide stop spring has a slight twist to it like the picture in GunnyBlue's post. When viewing the frame from the side, the entire spring rests inside the pocket with none of it protruding past the edge of the frame.

If I had to replace the spring, I would be inclined to adjust it as necessary and run with it.
Since I replaced my spring and "adjusted" it, I've put 200 rounds through it without any further problems.
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Old 01-18-2017, 05:08 PM   #57
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I checked my spring and it is NOT bulging on the side. I don't think it's my issue, unfortunately. Maybe, I just have a slide stop that is undersized. I plan to call Sig again because I think it is unacceptable for a gun of this supposed quality.
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Old 01-25-2017, 11:17 AM   #58
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Originally Posted by ThnkFrst View Post

I've run 1300 rounds thru the pistol without any malfunctions. During my last range session I fired 65 rounds and experienced 7 incidents of the slide locking back mid-mag; the slide lock had moved up enough to barely catch the slide catch notch in the slide. Depressing the slide catch lever released the slide and the pistol fired normally. Note; I verified that I wasn't hitting the slide lock when shooting.

Reported the problem to SIG CS and they are sending a replacement spring which I'll install and see if that resolves the problem. More to follow.
Thanks to SIG CS rep Amy, I received two replacement springs on Monday last. Installed one in my 938 yesterday and made a quick range trip to confirm that it resolved the problem of the slide locking back mid-mag. Though I only had time to run 21 rounds/3 mags, I'm happy to report that the pistol functioned flawlessly. Another more extensive range session should clear this pistol for carry rotation.

Edit: Put together a couple of pics showing the condition of the slide lock spring after the earlier range trip when slide started locking back mid-mag. The spring is riding up in the frame pocket (lower pic) and that had the effect of tilting the rear tail of the spring up (highlighted in green). At that angle it would seem that the spring was allowing the slide lock to come up just enough to catch the slide notch.
P938 SLL Spring (High).001.jpeg
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Last edited by ThnkFrst; 01-25-2017 at 03:56 PM. Reason: Added Info
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Old 01-25-2017, 05:36 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThnkFrst View Post
Thanks to SIG CS rep Amy, I received two replacement springs on Monday last. Installed one in my 938 yesterday and made a quick range trip to confirm that it resolved the problem of the slide locking back mid-mag. Though I only had time to run 21 rounds/3 mags, I'm happy to report that the pistol functioned flawlessly. Another more extensive range session should clear this pistol for carry rotation.

Edit: Put together a couple of pics showing the condition of the slide lock spring after the earlier range trip when slide started locking back mid-mag. The spring is riding up in the frame pocket (lower pic) and that had the effect of tilting the rear tail of the spring up (highlighted in green). At that angle it would seem that the spring was allowing the slide lock to come up just enough to catch the slide notch.
Attachment 98417
Yes. It doesn't take much.
But that will cause the 'Slide locking back" problem.
Glad you got it resolved.
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Old 01-26-2017, 09:38 PM   #60
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Just joined the site and after watching some videos of the 238 take down falling out like mine also, I was just Abile to fix it myself , works great now
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