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First suppressed SBR.. 556 or 300blk?

This is a discussion on First suppressed SBR.. 556 or 300blk? within the SIG Sauer Rifles forums, part of the SIG Sauer Forum category; Originally Posted by Steve40th We need a NFA section. Just saying. Can you put in for a sbr upper prior to actually buying the upper? ...


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Old 04-28-2016, 11:43 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Steve40th View Post
We need a NFA section. Just saying.
Can you put in for a sbr upper prior to actually buying the upper?
Seems strange to not have one?
Cans, SBRs, SBSs, MGs, AOWs and DDs. Not sure about everyone else but I know people in Florida that own all the above.
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Old 04-28-2016, 12:22 PM   #17
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An update of sorts.

I just got my trust paperwork back from my attorney. Total cost, $89.
Now I need to buy the rifle and the suppressor. Im going to have Silencer Shop do the tax stamp submission for the can.

I did manage to find an MCX in 300BLK for a great price (with the help of Mike). And its BNIB. So the tail chasing is winding down a bit.

Thanks everyone for the info and guidance. It is greatly appreciated.

E
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Old 04-28-2016, 12:24 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by MCX300BLKSBR View Post
An update of sorts.

I just got my trust paperwork back from my attorney. Total cost, $89.
Now I need to buy the rifle and the suppressor. Im going to have Silencer Shop do the tax stamp submission for the can.

I did manage to find an MCX in 300BLK for a great price (with the help of Mike). And its BNIB. So the tail chasing is winding down a bit.

Thanks everyone for the info and guidance. It is greatly appreciated.

E
Did you call DSC? I'd bet they have the can and gun in stock for you. They can do the paperwork. And the best thing is you can visit your gun/can and shoot it there while you wait for approval as they have an indoor range on premise.
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Old 04-28-2016, 12:43 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by Blanca Busa View Post
Did you call DSC? I'd bet they have the can and gun in stock for you. They can do the paperwork. And the best thing is you can visit your gun/can and shoot it there while you wait for approval as they have an indoor range on premise.
I appreciate the suggestion. But no, I haven't talked to them. Honestly, Im not really a fan of that place. They strike me as the typical know it all gun guys. Also, not sure I want to go to a place where 3 of their customers have decided to off themselves at their range. But I may go there anyway just to say I explored all options. Last time I went there, I remember their prices being pretty high.
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Old 04-28-2016, 12:56 PM   #20
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I appreciate the suggestion. But no, I haven't talked to them. Honestly, Im not really a fan of that place. They strike me as the typical know it all gun guys. Also, not sure I want to go to a place where 3 of their customers have decided to off themselves at their range. But I may go there anyway just to say I explored all options. Last time I went there, I remember their prices being pretty high.
Some of what you say is true.
People kill themselves at indoor ranges. Just a fact. I've witnessed two.
Prices are a bit on the high side. But not by much.

Yes if you want to fondle and see everything first hand it's a good place to go.
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Old 04-28-2016, 01:30 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Blanca Busa View Post
Some of what you say is true.
People kill themselves at indoor ranges. Just a fact. I've witnessed two.
Prices are a bit on the high side. But not by much.

Yes if you want to fondle and see everything first hand it's a good place to go.
Yeah, it's a good idea to pay them a visit. I'll try to get there this weekend.

Edit;
Called DSC. They have everything but 300blk. They were very cool on the phone. I believe I was talking to the owners son. I asked him for a price on the 556 pistol they had in stock. He wouldn't give me a price. He said a "range from $1200 and up". Which doesn't mean much because I KNOW they don't sell them for $1200. Also asked if he had one that I could shoot with a suppressor. Answer was "no". But I understand that.
Looks like I'll just end up buying the 16" BLK. But I'm going to go in there this weekend to put hands on one.
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Last edited by MCX300BLKSBR; 04-28-2016 at 01:53 PM.
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Old 04-28-2016, 02:46 PM   #22
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I received this from the law office that did my trust. I think there is some good info in it. Hope I'm not out of line by posting this. But I think it's worth a read for anyone that is new (like myself) to the stamp collecting process.




"***THE ATF'S RECENT RULING ON ATF 41F DOES NOT HAVE ANY IMMEDIATE IMPACT ON YOUR TRUST. After July, the ATF will no longer require a CLEO signature, however it will be replaced by a background check for each trustee, along with fingerprints and passport photos. Presently, the ATF is still accepting applications the way they always have.

Please find your NFA Trust attached along with your Gun Trust Package. Please read your Gun Trust Package FIRST, as this will explain your next steps and answer many of your questions.

Your Gun Trust Package also includes a sample Form 1, Certificate of Compliance, and a Form 5320.20 in case you move, or plan on taking the Title II item with you on an extended trip. A general amendment form is also included which will allow you to make any changes, plus a trustee acceptance form will officially add trustees in the future.

Please review the trust prior to getting it signed, and let me know if you would like to make any changes.

***If you plan on submitting a Form 1 (application for building a Title II/Class 3 Weapon), use ATF's eFiling online, clients are getting approvals within 90 days. ATF still has not re-opened eFiling for Form 4 transfers."



I deleted some things for obvious reasons, but I found it interesting.
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Old 04-29-2016, 04:43 AM   #23
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Got a response from Silencer Shop. They are suggesting the Griffin Armament Optimus for a can. Because I told them I would prefer one that I can put on my AR and on my 9mm S&W CORE bedside gun.
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Old 04-29-2016, 08:33 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by MCX300BLKSBR View Post
.... THE ATF'S RECENT RULING ON ATF 41F DOES NOT HAVE ANY IMMEDIATE IMPACT ON YOUR TRUST. After July, the ATF will no longer require a CLEO signature, however it will be replaced by a background check for each trustee, along with fingerprints and passport photos. Presently, the ATF is still accepting applications the way they always have....
Good information here, as far as it goes. We'll add a couple points just to be clear. 41F greatly expands the number of people and documentation included in future NFA stamp applications for gun trust applicants.

A lot of guys, including myself had setup both Successor Trustees and Beneficiaries in our original gun trust. 41F requires all of these individuals to submit to the background checks, photos & fingerprinting.

So, in a typical pre-41 gun trust with a wife and couple children listed as successor &/or beneficiaries, the people involved goes from 1 to 4. That also means there is 4 times the documentation - and BATF processing required before their approval.

So, that can you ordered from Silencer Shop today will require a Form 3 FFL Transfer (assuming you're not gonna pickup directly from Silencer Shop), plus a Form 4.

Pre-41, that can's stamp will probably take 6 to 8mths. After July, when 41 becomes effective .. Well, it's not gonna be 4 times 8 mths, but 2.5 to 3 times seems a reasonable expectation...

So, while I guess it's technically correct that 41F doesn't directly effect a gun trust - it's sure gonna feel like a huge effect!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MCX300BLKSBR View Post
Got a response from Silencer Shop. They are suggesting the Griffin Armament Optimus for a can. Because I told them I would prefer one that I can put on my AR and on my 9mm S&W CORE bedside gun.
IMO, Silencer Shop is the world's best suppressor source for both information and purchases. Reliable advise and complete stock of all-things suppressor related is what they do. Am sure their Griffin suggestion is the best fit for the priorities you gave them.

Suggest that you make sure you're comfortable with those priorities before completing your purchase. I mean, budget, caliber, sound suppression & compatabilities are all important.

For rifle calibers, gas blowback is another important consideration. Particularly shooting SBRs, gas can be annoying outdoors - indoors you may want'a shoot something else, or just go home.

Adding NFA weapons to our armory has been a learning experience. They're fun to shoot, and add great defensive capabilities for our family. While all the formalities are expensive and a huge hassle - it's worth it!

Cheers

Last edited by kansascity45; 04-29-2016 at 08:37 AM.
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Old 04-29-2016, 08:44 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by kansascity45 View Post
Good information here, as far as it goes. We'll add a couple points just to be clear. 41F greatly expands the number of people and documentation included in future NFA stamp applications for gun trust applicants.

A lot of guys, including myself had setup both Successor Trustees and Beneficiaries in our original gun trust. 41F requires all of these individuals to submit to the background checks, photos & fingerprinting.

So, in a typical pre-41 gun trust with a wife and couple children listed as successor &/or beneficiaries, the people involved goes from 1 to 4. That also means there is 4 times the documentation - and BATF processing required before their approval.

So, that can you ordered from Silencer Shop today will require a Form 3 FFL Transfer (assuming you're not gonna pickup directly from Silencer Shop), plus a Form 4.

Pre-41, that can's stamp will probably take 6 to 8mths. After July, when 41 becomes effective .. Well, it's not gonna be 4 times 8 mths, but 2.5 to 3 times seems a reasonable expectation...

So, while I guess it's technically correct that 41F doesn't directly effect a gun trust - it's sure gonna feel like a huge effect!!



IMO, Silencer Shop is the world's best suppressor source for both information and purchases. Reliable advise and complete stock of all-things suppressor related is what they do. Am sure their Griffin suggestion is the best fit for the priorities you gave them.

Suggest that you make sure you're comfortable with those priorities before completing your purchase. I mean, budget, caliber, sound suppression & compatabilities are all important.

For rifle calibers, gas blowback is another important consideration. Particularly shooting SBRs, gas can be annoying outdoors - indoors you may want'a shoot something else, or just go home.

Adding NFA weapons to our armory has been a learning experience. They're fun to shoot, and add great defensive capabilities for our family. While all the formalities are expensive and a huge hassle - it's worth it!

Cheers
Thanks for the info. I actually asked my attorney to revise my trust to have just my name on it. I did that for the sake of time. Once I get the tax stamps back, I ll go through the process of getting my brother and wife on the trust.
In regards to Silencer Shop, their inventory/stock was a little misleading. Their website says that basically ALL of their cans are out of stock. But after emailing them I think I know why they are advertised that way. It seems they are playing a bit of a shell game so the ATF doesn't have knowledge of what they actually have. Which I understand. The response I got from SS kinda confirmed that. He mentioned a few options for me, and said that they were in fact in stock. I could have misinterpreted the email, but I think I might be right.
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Old 04-29-2016, 08:55 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by kansascity45 View Post
Good information here, as far as it goes. We'll add a couple points just to be clear. 41F greatly expands the number of people and documentation included in future NFA stamp applications for gun trust applicants.

A lot of guys, including myself had setup both Successor Trustees and Beneficiaries in our original gun trust. 41F requires all of these individuals to submit to the background checks, photos & fingerprinting.

So, in a typical pre-41 gun trust with a wife and couple children listed as successor &/or beneficiaries, the people involved goes from 1 to 4. That also means there is 4 times the documentation - and BATF processing required before their approval.

So, that can you ordered from Silencer Shop today will require a Form 3 FFL Transfer (assuming you're not gonna pickup directly from Silencer Shop), plus a Form 4.

Pre-41, that can's stamp will probably take 6 to 8mths. After July, when 41 becomes effective .. Well, it's not gonna be 4 times 8 mths, but 2.5 to 3 times seems a reasonable expectation...

So, while I guess it's technically correct that 41F doesn't directly effect a gun trust - it's sure gonna feel like a huge effect!!



IMO, Silencer Shop is the world's best suppressor source for both information and purchases. Reliable advise and complete stock of all-things suppressor related is what they do. Am sure their Griffin suggestion is the best fit for the priorities you gave them.

Suggest that you make sure you're comfortable with those priorities before completing your purchase. I mean, budget, caliber, sound suppression & compatabilities are all important.

For rifle calibers, gas blowback is another important consideration. Particularly shooting SBRs, gas can be annoying outdoors - indoors you may want'a shoot something else, or just go home.

Adding NFA weapons to our armory has been a learning experience. They're fun to shoot, and add great defensive capabilities for our family. While all the formalities are expensive and a huge hassle - it's worth it!

Cheers
Beneficiaries are not required to submit any documentation once 41p goes into effect. If you are the sole trustor/trustee then all you need to submit is your photo, fingerprints, etc. The ATF does not need the finger prints of your 3 year old because 50 years from now he may take possession of all your NFA assets..

https://nfalawyers.com/final-ruling-atf-41p/
One of many sources on who will need to submit finger prints, photos for 41p. Contact the lawyer that drafted your trust for confirmation. My trust lists a successor and beneficiaries, none of these people currently have any power over my trust so they are exempt from the documentation requirements of 41p.

Last edited by IUOE Mike; 04-29-2016 at 09:06 AM.
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Old 04-29-2016, 08:56 AM   #27
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Thanks for the info. I actually asked my attorney to revise my trust to have just my name on it. I did that for the sake of time. Once I get the tax stamps back, I ll go through the process of getting my brother and wife on the trust.
In regards to Silencer Shop, their inventory/stock was a little misleading. Their website says that basically ALL of their cans are out of stock. But after emailing them I think I know why they are advertised that way. It seems they are playing a bit of a shell game so the ATF doesn't have knowledge of what they actually have. Which I understand. The response I got from SS kinda confirmed that. He mentioned a few options for me, and said that they were in fact in stock. I could have misinterpreted the email, but I think I might be right.
Sure, happy to help. We amended our trust removing everyone but me, so wouldn't be in a hurry to add bro & wifey. And, understand SS's stocking issues right now. We recently purchased a SIG 762 can from them, and may do another before July.

Given 41F's schedule, we can expect all NFA class weapons to become very difficult to find. Those vendors need to complete most of their annual sales goal before July too...

Cheers
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Old 04-29-2016, 09:13 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by kansascity45 View Post
Sure, happy to help. We amended our trust removing everyone but me, so wouldn't be in a hurry to add bro & wifey. And, understand SS's stocking issues right now. We recently purchased a SIG 762 can from them, and may do another before July.

Given 41F's schedule, we can expect all NFA class weapons to become very difficult to find. Those vendors need to complete most of their annual sales goal before July too...

Cheers
Interesting about the vendors selling before the 41f. Never thought of that.
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Old 04-29-2016, 09:24 AM   #29
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Sure, happy to help. We amended our trust removing everyone but me, so wouldn't be in a hurry to add bro & wifey.
Cheers
I hope you had a competent trust attorney draft your trust, this would be a clear violation of Pennsylvanians Uniform Trust Code. You cannot be named the sole trustor/trustee with no one named as a successor/beneficiary in the state of PA, I cannot speak on CO or any other state. You may not be a successor/beneficiary to your own trust either.

Not trying to be a dick just don't want anyone to get jammed up.
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Old 04-29-2016, 10:43 AM   #30
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Why not consider the 6.8 SPC as well?
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