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Rusty chamber and worn trigger after only 424 rounds

11K views 71 replies 35 participants last post by  Steve Shannon 
#1 ·
I'm a new gun owner and bought a P365 XL from a major retailer. Before firing my first round, I cleaned the gun as recommended by Sig's FAQs. I used Break-Free CLP-2 Cleaner Lubricant Preservative Aerosol. The gun is stored in a handgun safe in my nightstand and has not been exposed to moisture.

On 3 visits the range over the course of 3 weeks, I've fired 400 rounds of Blazer Brass 5201 124 gr FMJ and 24 rounds of +P Speer Gold Dot CCI53617 124 gr JHP. I bought the +P ammo by mistake not realizing it was +P, but the gun is rated to handle it, so I'm thinking that should not be a problem. Lesson learned.

During use, the slide would lock back with one round left in the magazine about 25% of the time. My third trip to the range was specifically to figure out if it was limited to one of the two stock mags and it seemed like it was. I marked it and sent the gun back to Sig for warranty repair. Very pleased with the customer service, by the way. It was only 7 days between leaving my house and getting the gun back.

When the gun came back, these were among the comments:
Pistol very dirty & void of any lube.
Barrel very dirty, rusty chamber.
Replaced barrel.
Replaced striker assy.
Replaced worn trigger & pin.
Replaced ( 2 ) mags.

The owners manual says to clean and lubricate before or after every day the pistol is fired or at a minimum of every 500 rounds. I did not clean or lubricate after each time to the range, so the void of any lube comment is on me. I'll clean/lube more often from now on. I'm surprised at some of the other comments.

Rusty chamber?
The trigger was worn?
Could I have been sold a used gun?
Or could these parts were replaced to cover any possible cause of the issue and those are the canned responses that the gunsmith could select?

Thanks for any advice.
 
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#5 ·
I live in NC, which at this time of year is already humid, so that might be a factor. However, except for getting from the car to the range, since buying in late May, the gun has been stored in an air conditioned and humidity controlled home. If humidity is indeed the issue, I'm not sure what I can do to avoid the problem. Surely others in the south east US own Sigs and don't have a rusty chamber after less than a month. Hopefully, more frequent cleaning and lubricating will help. Any other advice is appreciated.
 
#7 ·
Where in NC? I am in New Bern and have 3 P365’s with zero issues of rust so far. I carry and wipe down daily to prevent sweat from causing rust issues, I have been using RemOil drylube, but I recently got some Boeshield T9 based on some feedback read here on the forums. Hopefully your issue is resolved though and will not come back.
 
#21 ·
if pre-owned, is there a way to trace the resignation history. A Carfax for guns (don’t anyone steal my trademarked idea).
 
#8 ·
I expected it to be new - as I paid retail price at an outdoor sports store. If it was used, I would hope the store would have told me. I will say, that when I bought it, there were none in the case and the first salesperson said they did not have any, while another sales person off to the side said they had one "over here" and pulled one out from a back room. Sounds a little suspicious. It appeared to have all the paperwork and accessories like new in the box with the serial number sticker on the outside as well. I'm pretty sure it was new. At this point, I assume it's moot to question, as even if it wan't new, I don't know how I could possibly prove that at this point. Is there a serial number check I could do?
 
#10 ·
Their description of the condition and what they did to it sounds SO far off how it could be based on the history you describe, that I have to wonder if they mixed up the description of what was done on yours, with the description of what they did to another.
 
#11 ·
Not sure what retailer you bought from, but if they take trades, they likely sold you a used gun. No way does a trigger wear out from a couple QC rounds (if Sig even does that with all guns off the assembly line).

I don’t think it could have rusted like that in the short time you had it either. Sounds like someone used it in a very wet climate (or dropped it water and didn’t clean it).

Sounds like they took care of you though. Even if you don’t clean after every range trip, you should use gun oil in the usual spots every couple hundred rounds or so (slide, barrel, etc.). Only takes about 6-8 total drops. I’d use actual gun oil with an applicator where you can specifically direct the drops where you need them.
 
#18 ·
This seems very odd. I am glad to hear the OP has the gun back and all issues are resolved (Did I hear that correctly?)

400 rounds is not a large number. I would expect any modern service pistol to go through a typical high-round count class (high round count = greater than 600-800 per day) without issue. It may require additional lube, but a gun that would not run that long without cleaning would not really suit my needs. For large count, multiday classes, I field strip, clean and lube per manual, in the evenings. I would not want the built-up of caked on carbon and firing residue to stay on there longer than normal. Especially the next day, after the residue had a chance to harden up. It requires an effort, cleaning a gun after a hot day in the sun, but I do it anyway. In fact, I clean my equipment before dinner, so I'm motivated. :)

For normal range trips to the square range, or for matches, yes, I will clean after each. I too like the smell of Hoppe's. :)

As to the collection of comments as stated (rust, etc.), they seem at odds with a new firearm purchase, even with a scant 400 rounds? I too wonder if the text reported wasn't perhaps entered against another firearm in for service. Or, the gun was sold as new, but in fact was used. If there were pictures of the gun after the 400 rounds, but before the service, that would be extremely interesting.

Anyway, I am glad to hear Sig CS stepped up and sorted this out.
 
#20 ·
I shoot a lot (two-three times a week) so cleaning after shooting is a wast of time and not needed. All that is needed is to pull a boresnake through the barrel two-three times and a little grease on the end of the barrel, slide groves, and a light coating of oil on the slide/trigger. Then about every 800-1000 rounds do a cleaning. I carry IWB every day with no rust.
 
#25 ·
If you’re concerned about whether the gun you bought is new, first check the serial # on the gun versus on the box, as well as the born on date/date of manufacture on the case. Provided the serial #s match, then the manufacture date on the case will tell you how old it was when you bought it. If you’re still concerned, then call SIG customer service back and ask them about the armorer’s comments. They should be able to explain what the armorer diagnosed as the problems to be fixed versus what you thought was the problem when you sent it in.

Keep in mind, that when the armorer got it and went over it, any defect he found that was not visible to you would be noted. It is possible that the armorer found a very small amount of rust in the original barrel that you couldn’t see and decided the easiest fix was just a new barrel. Along similar lines, it is possible the trigger was just on the edge of spec enough that it had worn funny. Not to the point you would notice, but that the armorer would during inspection. And here too the simplest solution was just to replace it.

All of that said, glad to read they took good care of you, got your 365 fixed, and may you have many years of enjoyable use with it.
 
#27 ·
It's my inclination that most guns returned for service end up with parts hung on them, rather than real diagnosis by a gunsmith.
This might certainly be the case with your gun, tho' the claimed wear/rust does seem out of the norm.
If your gun is functioning to your satisfaction now, just smile and say thank you.
As regards cleaning, more guns worn out from excess cleaning than excess shooting, and clean guns don't get shot.
Give it a dab of lube as needed, and a full cleaning if you're going to carry it.
Moon
 
#28 · (Edited)
You'll never know why but, to be blunt, you were likely sold a "compromised" gun no matter where it came from or the "why's". There's no way a gun shot 3 times in 3 weeks and not cleaned should have a rusty barrel if kept inside. if you cleaned it when new and lubed it properly, there's no way they could say there was void of lube. There is (was) either a problem with the slide, magazines or both. Worn trigger and striker....no way if the gun was new. I think the Sig "gunsmith" is full of it and you really don't know why what happened should not have happened. They just parts changed. I would get rid of the gun because I could never trust it, whether parts were changed or not. What else happened to it you don't know about? CS did jump on it but is it as good as a 400 round gun should be? BTW, Blazer Brass will never go through another gun I own. Dirty as hell.
 
#29 ·
Im no gun smith but, I am from NY and we sometimes we think differently. Maybe they couldn't really figure out why it was hanging up. But could reproduce the hang up. So instead of indicating something was wrong with gun "kinda" blamed you, replaced a bunch of parts. And wala (what does wala mean??) it fixed the problem. I know alot of car michanics that work like this. Keep replacing parts till its fixed. But usually it costs me a few $$
 
#30 ·
I too live in NC and yes, its hot and humid. My 365XL is approaching 4,000 rounds and is carried daily as well as gets shot in matches regularly. I take a walk most every morning and when it's this hot I holster the gun in a Raven Vanguard that is basically a trigger guard with a belt clip. I'm also a fat guy who sweats (probably the only one) and the gun is wet when I finish my walk. If I don't wipe it down for 2-3 days in a row, I get a little rust developing on the slide release and the take down lever. Never seen any rust inside the gun anywhere. Never had any malfunction of any kind either.
 
#33 ·
Rusted barrel- maybe in a very hot and humid climate and the gun stored in room temperature without A/C but no way would you have a worn trigger after just 3 visits to the range. I would go back to the dealer and ask to check if the gun was factory new or used. If they are honest, they will check and let you know. If, in fact, they sold you a used gun for the price of new one, then some kind of a discount for a future gun/ammo/accessory purchase would be expected.
 
#37 ·
I hate to be a cynic, but it does sound suspicious for being a gun that was used and not cared for. Maybe a gun range rental with the owner not registering the warranty? Good news is Sig service. All"s well that ends well. Lesson learned is always know who your buying from. Enjoy your now perfect pistol. Stay well.
 
#38 ·
Thanks everyone for all the comments. I finally got back to the range after getting the gun back and bad news - maybe. Assuming all of the components were indeed replaced with new parts, I still experienced the locked back slide issue on the last round one time on the 24 round, which was the last round from the second magazine. It has always been the last round in the magazine and based on everything I've read and watched about failure to return to battery, that is not what's happening. I shot the most of the rest of the ammo from that same magazine and towards the end was loading 5 or 6 rounds in the magazine to check that "last round" scenario and much as possible with the ammo I had.

So I'm wondering at this point if this is an issue with using 124 grain FMJ ammo. Maybe this model is finicky. Maybe, it's a break-in thing. I just don't know.

At this point, I can try to go back to the place I bought it (can I post their name here?), but I'm pretty sure they will not admit to selling me a used gun and I don't know of any way to verify/check their story. However, it's worth a try and if I ask the direct question and get an answer that turns out to be false, I figure I will have that going for me.

I posted a video of one time I had the problem. Four rounds, no problem, then 5th and final in the magazine hangs the slide back. I'd be curious to know what people think - failure to return to battery or something else?
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1NiB4kiVRv8vUZqsDs6Mf2tenYx-42Efc/view?usp=sharing

Oh - and I cleaned and lubed the gun immediately after getting home from the range.
 
#40 ·
Congratulations on your new Sig .

Your video only shows your shoulder part of the time while shooting. Not very useful for helping diagnose what you're dealing with.

Rather than look to the gun and ammo being the problem, it's important to realize that your handgun is new, and it's recoil springs are new.

In order for it to cycle properly, including cycling the last round to leave the chamber open and slide locked back, it needs the proper support platform to recoil against.

What little I saw of your wrists shows them flexing, not supporting the gun.

My guess is that you need to consier studying proper hand hold, support and shooting stance.

I'm a volunteer instructor at the Sir Walter Gun Club near Creedmoor. Look into classes at a club or experienced LGS near you.
 
#43 ·
Agree that the video does not show my grip or the gun. When I recorded it, I was pretty much thinking it was a magazine problem and was focusing on just capturing the last round still in there when the slide locked back.

I do see others talk about failure to return to battery issues caused by limp wrist grip, so I guess it's possible that the problem is my grip. I'm new so I'm open to all suggestions. I will say that when this happens, it is ALWAYS the last round in the magazine. I'll definitely look to learn more about grip techniques, so thanks for the suggestion.

I shot a total of 178 rounds during that visit and it happened only that one time on round 24 when I was using a two-handed grip. Around 125 or so, I did fire the gun one-handed, both left- and right-handed to see if that would cause it, but it did not and I definitely felt the gun move more.

Thanks again for the comments.
 
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